Andrew Lasky (00:18)
Everybody welcome back to the commissions and cashflow show. I am your host, Andrew Lasky. Today I have Costa Eklman. Costa, welcome to the show brother.

Konstantin Ekelman (00:31)
Nice to see you, Drew.

Andrew Lasky (00:32)
you are in the facility supply sector. Could you just tell the audience a little bit about your background, how you got into sales and where you are today?

Konstantin Ekelman (00:43)
Yeah, absolutely. Story starts a while back. You never really think when I'm little, I want to go into sales. I came to Chicago in 1991. We immigrated from Ukraine.

And when I landed in Chicago, the biggest thing happening in town was Michael Jordan and the Chicago Bulls. So when I grew up, I wanted to play in the NBA and then I got humbled with my height, my size and my dreams there. So I had to go a different direction. But I had a very lucky upbringing. Parents were incredible role models.

I mean the work ethic they had coming to this country and sacrificing all their visions and dreams back in Ukraine were totally sacrificed and it shaped me very early on and allowed me to have that kind of inherently in me. So I'm very lucky for that.

and had my grandparents shaping me as well. The stories, the wisdom they had, spending some time with them was beautiful. so, yeah, growing up a Bulls fan in Chicago, it's kind of given me, know, sports has given me a lot of discipline, which I now recognize in sales, having the ability to miss shots, work hard, see yourself get better, all the things in sales that we at the time take for granted that we appreciate later in life.

So I started, you went to college in Bradley University in Peoria, where I went into finance and really I got really good at being social in school and had some fun. But took the first job I can and it was 2008 when I graduated Wells Fargo Financial and was selling subprime mortgages and credit cards, inside sales position, totally through and through.

And that's where I cut my teeth in sales, making 50 calls a day. That was really good for my tough skin and learning how to talk to people and getting rejected. was such a great start to my career looking back.

I did that for two years and then I moved over to a company called Aramark Uniform Services where I worked there for nine years. And that's really where I had my first outside sales position, B2B sales. And it was really great because I still did that 40, 50 phone calls a day, but I was calling on restaurants and manufacturing facilities and healthcare. And so really got exposed to different places and really learned about the sales process that starting with a phone call.

So that was an interesting nine years there. I had my own territory for three years, got promoted to larger accounts, did that well where I worked with other reps on the team, having bigger territories, did that well. And early on in my career, I faced rejection internally where I thought I was ready for a sales manager position.

interviewed, thought I was the dude, ready to go. Did not get it. But that was the best thing that ever happened because then I went back to the drawing board, refined my skills, became a better leader, and then continued to make these trips, the President's trip that we're aware of in sales. There's a lot of incentive trips. Did that well and then got another opportunity and managed a team in Chicago and then Milwaukee, Wisconsin, which was great.

Head mentors along the way at at airmark and One of them is actually my boss today, which is my company I'm at today, which I'll talk about in a second, but

This gentleman was a good leader and at Airmark really learned the sales process very closely and had someone that was listening to my phone calls giving instant feedback, instant advice. in that role at Airmark, it was kind of cool because when you don't do outside sales, you learn what they teach you and you go out there and you start making those meetings that you set up.

And I was striking out early on in my career. I couldn't understand why I was following the process. And I had this aha moment. And it was really simple. was, I was talking to a Mexican restaurant owner and I asked the question. said, tell me about your journey of how you became a restaurant owner. And just, he started telling me about how he came to this country and want to bring some recipes and.

started with his brother and had his kids working there. And he was so proud of the recipes and the local business. And by the end of it, he says, so yeah, I'm ready to move forward. And he said the service that I was there for initially. And that was my aha moment to realize, wow, like this rapport building is extremely important. And being interested, being curious was something that I very much learned from that meeting.

And I definitely carried that on to all of my meetings and all of a sudden closing ratio started to improve because I was there for the genuine story and the curiosity of everyone's journey. And it was interesting to me because I'm an immigrant myself and my parents made it in this country and it was really cool to hear someone else share theirs. And so there's so many of those stories across the country. And I think if we take the time to listen, that was really important for me to learn. And I stress that to my team today.

I had to 2018 so I was at Airmark 2009 in 2018. 2018 I started at North American.

I'm very, very lucky to work there. So right now I represent myself as a sales director for its North American proudly part of Brady Plus. And we are a leader in janitorial food service and packaging supplies in the country. We work in the United States and we're calling and selling to commercial real estate properties. We're selling to hotels, healthcare, stadiums, hospitality, manufacturing, food processing, and

We're making these buildings healthier and safer every day. So we're getting them the essential supplies they need for their restaurant products. We're getting them whatever they need to make sure that they have their food service supplies to work in the restaurants or the containers and manufacturing. it's a very important job and we have a big responsibility to do it right. And we add that to value of support. We wanna make sure that we're giving them that extra level of service. So it's been a good ride so far and you know,

Really grateful to be there.

Andrew Lasky (06:50)
You know, came back, you refined your skills, you went back to the drawing board. Like what exactly did that look like? Because now you've become so much more successful from that moment. And clearly it was a turning point in your career.

Konstantin Ekelman (07:04)
No, for sure. think experience is what allows us to be effective. Reading a room when you're in a sales meeting, I mean, I can be sitting in a room with a CEO, a cleaning technician, a purchasing agent, and every one of those individuals and positions I mentioned are looking for different things. And I think being able to see those things coming at you live and in action, it's pretty important.

No matter how you slice it and dice it, nothing can replace experience. No different than, you know, if I relate it to basketball is being able to dribble and looking up versus looking down at the ball. And then the next step is being able to dribble looking up and seeing the play ahead. That's what made the players like Kobe and MJ so, so effective. They, they were three steps ahead. So in a sales meeting, no different, you're sitting at a table and you're having a conversation and you know what to ask each person.

and then understanding different personalities. And so when I had that additional time to get that experience, it made me effective to read a room in a sales meeting and add value to those counterparts that I was helping close business for. But then as a sales leader, being a rep myself, I wasn't...

giving any advice to anyone that I haven't done myself. And so I was able to see different reps and even on my team now, everyone's slightly different, right? We all have the same goal, but we can go about it different ways. And it was really special to kind of remember and reflect on my own experiences and tap into those to talk to them and meet them where they're at. Whether I'm in a sales meeting trying to close business with a client.

or just with my sales team trying to make them better and coaching them because I've been in their shoes. So that extra time allowed me to really refine those skills so that when I was ready for it and continued and consistently put in numbers, I was able to be there for the success.

Andrew Lasky (08:46)
That's awesome. And so I remember you saying in the beginning that you started in inside sales, which is a great way to get what I call it the training wheels of the sales industry. So I started out in door to door sales back 10 years ago, and it was really difficult. And I watched a lot of other salespeople start in outside sales positions. And they kind of got like a bad taste in their mouth because it was like a whole nother level of like

Konstantin Ekelman (08:59)
Mm.

Andrew Lasky (09:14)
difficulty, no matter really what you're selling, if like outside sales is like your first job, but being that you did inside sales and then transitioned to outside sales, I guess what was it about the inside sales, like training that you got or that experience that kind of like propelled you to be successful in outside sales right away?

Konstantin Ekelman (09:19)
Mm-hmm.

So when I look at my career of sales, I think the first job I had for two years, it taught me how to be very effective on the phone.

And you have to be effective on the phone and you have to be short. You have to be concise. And I was calling more consumer base. was calling, I was B2C, right? I was calling people after they were done with work. Maybe they were about to start dinner with their families and I'm calling there at four o'clock, 4.35. And I'm talking about their personal finances, which is very deep and meaningful to them. And then when I went into outside sales, that phone work and those skills that I learned, and also just the muscle of having the discipline and the endurance, I think that's the key word

Andrew Lasky (09:51)
Mmm.

Konstantin Ekelman (10:11)
endurance to be able to call consistently and know that this is the right thing to do. And then you go to outside sales where you do the phone work to get meetings and now it's more B2B. With B2B, it's a little bit more of logical approach. Every business wants to save money, drive value, get the latest and greatest innovation. That's important to them and there's people dedicated to help drive those things.

where B to C, could have, you're just dealing with people's habits and some people have bad habits with finances. And think about this, I'm a 21 year old kid at the time living at home with my parents. And I'm trying to offer financial advice to folks that are twice as old as me, three times as old as me that have families already. And I'm trying to consult with them. And so you also deal with the fact that these people are looking at me, even though they don't have some of their stuff together and I'm just keeping it candid.

Andrew Lasky (10:39)
I sure do.

Konstantin Ekelman (11:00)
They see me as, what is this young kid gonna tell me and how is he gonna help me? And so you have to kind of level set with that as well.

Andrew Lasky (11:07)
Yeah. And so for somebody that let's say they're in inside sales right now and they're listening to this and they want to transition into outside sales, what advice would you give them of like something that they might encounter or like challenges that they're going to have similar to like what you had when you switched?

Konstantin Ekelman (11:25)
It's a great question. I think the biggest challenge for me was, and it was more of an opportunity and it was exciting, is the flexibility. But with flexibility comes comfort. So in inside sales, you're in an office, you got other people around you that are typically in that environment.

You have your manager that's right there at all times, more or less micromanaging you, which is good. Early on, I appreciated the fact that I had a sales manager that sat right behind me. I couldn't go on Gmail. I couldn't go on Facebook, Instagram at the time, whatever you want to look at YouTube. There was someone right behind me looking at my screen. And so that was good. That's the positive I take out of it. You go to outside sales and you have a one-on-one usually once a week or multiple times a day.

you have the week that you create for yourself. And there's a lot of flexibility with that. And I think where a lot of reps tend to struggle is comfort takes over. They decide themselves, you know, like I got to practice my golf game. I've got to get to the gym earlier. I got some groceries to do, you know, and as I'm saying this, it kind of creates that in this virtual environment that we're in today too, in 2025, where

It's a lot of self-discipline. So I think what you'll encounter is a lot of flexibility, but you'll also encounter those obstacles and distractions. And so you have to be self-motivated, I think is the key to the success with outside sales. And for those that can be those CEOs of their territories, the CEOs of their book of business, be treated that way and know that you're just cheating yourself if you take that shortcut. You're going to be super successful if you be honest with yourself and look in that mirror.

Andrew Lasky (12:54)
love that you said that because like a lot of people They're not like self reflecting on truly like what they're doing like okay, did you make the 50 phone calls? Did you knock on the 20 doors only you can be really be truthful with yourself as to if you did the activity or not. So I love that you said that not only being motivated, but really being like discipline.

Konstantin Ekelman (13:13)
Yeah.

Andrew Lasky (13:17)
Because you have so much freedom in outside sales that if you take advantage of it, you know, you're only hurting yourself.

Konstantin Ekelman (13:24)
Yeah, and like you said, you door to door. mean, what a great way to build that muscle to walk up to that door and on the other end know that anticipate there's might not be a friendly face excited to see you, but you do it because you know that it's a numbers game and I hate to take it back to the textbook old fashioned approach. But even when you get rejected, even when you don't get that sale, it makes you better.

It's another repetition. It's another opportunity for you to practice saying it. So it becomes subconscious. you internalize the scripts that you set out to say. And then guess what? You end up making friends and building relationships if you do it right. all of a sudden the confidence, because I think confidence, the more you do it, the more confident you seem. And people want to deal with confident people.

Andrew Lasky (14:09)
And I think too, like going to like the door to door or just sales in general, when you know what like the law of averages states, like if you know your numbers and you know that you're going to get rejected or deal with a certain amount of nasty people throughout the process, you almost kind of like laugh about it because you know that you're like one step closer to getting what you want, which is helping somebody and making a living.

doing that. So Costa, let's dive into your industry specifically. So this is the first time on the show that we've had somebody that's in your industry. So what does the typical day to day look like?

Konstantin Ekelman (14:41)
Mm-hmm.

My favorite part about where I'm at today and the company that I'm at today is one day I will be at Wrigley Field in the locker room talking to the facility operations manager about their supply needs for the stadium and their expected attendance, which is always full, for example, for the Cubs. Next day, I'll be in a food processing facility looking at how fruit is manufactured and put into containers that we sell to them.

Next day I'll be at the Willis Tower, the Sears Tower for those that are familiar with Chicago. It's the tallest building on their sky deck talking about all the facility supply needs that they need for that office building. And we're talking through a whole tele occupancy and challenges during the pandemic. so every day is different, which is a lot of fun.

and you're out building relationships with people. The way that we do that at our company is we do a lot of, you know, our mission statement is supplies and support. We want to delight our customers every day. We treat every delivery as if it's a gift. That's how we differentiate our company versus some of our competitors is we try and be that high touch dedicated rep service. And so yes, we'll have a good e-commerce experience that can go on, place product orders.

But our team is really close to if there's a back order, we'll make sure that.

We communicate about it proactively. Their supply chain disruption, which happened during the pandemic, you know, it's a good reference point for when a true company shines, right? When everything's going right and supply chain's beautiful, everyone should be pretty decent, right? Should be really good. Fill rates should be high. But how do you react when things aren't so good and so perfect? So our reps are out there. They're trying to get new accounts and they're retaining the existing accounts that they have. And we do that through the vehicle of

a business review, which we want to do at least quarterly. And at those business reviews, we want to accomplish three things. Talk about the service experience, ask very simple questions. How is the experience going so far? We talk about budget. We talk about innovations. Think about it like this. Our customers in supply chain world,

They're usually, these decision makers, they're responsible for a lot of different things. And think about the hats that in 2025, purchasing folks and facility folks are wearing. They're wearing multiple hats. So they can't be experts in everything. And so we get to be the ears and eyes of the road. How to make them more sustainable. How do we drive savings? What kind of projects can we help them with? Let us be the experts for you. And so that's kind of the model that we have.

day to day and that's what I think makes our rub successful. It makes it fun too because we feel very valued in an environment that's highly driven as a commodity, right? Because commodity, we sell, everyone sells toilet paper, everyone sells hand sanitizer and soap and you name it. But the way that we deliver it,

Andrew Lasky (17:21)
Mm-hmm.

Konstantin Ekelman (17:29)
and the way that we help them get around it is kind of what makes us special. And so our reps, we want them to be out in the field every day. If they're in the office or at home, their homes usually have toilet paper and their work offices already have that. So let's go out and find places that don't. That's kind of my philosophy. But just driving value and building relationships. I think that's the fun part. If you enjoy that, you're gonna love it and you're gonna pay a lot of money. If you don't like that, you're just not in the right place.

Andrew Lasky (17:54)
Yeah.

So your company really shines when it comes to like logistics and fulfillment. That's really like the crux of your pitch when you guys are talking about what separates you from everybody else in this commoditized industry.

Konstantin Ekelman (18:09)
so Brady Plus, we have 180 distribution centers across the country and we're building the first integrated distribution company in our space, fully integrated company and we specialize in three things. So what differentiates us is we're gonna be the first fully integrated company and we specialize in Janssen food service supplies and packaging supplies.

And what makes us different is that we have that support and support comes with people. We're not trying to replace people and we're not trying to have people only go online and have a 1-800 call center that they call. We're all about having that extra level of support. And, you know, I, maybe it's TMI or not, but when I'm talking to our leadership executive team and they're

talking about our success in Chicago, for instance, they're asking, do you more people? Keep up the success, but do you need more people? mean, that's, your money where your mouth is. A mission statement sounds sexy, but if you can put your money where your mouth is and say, do you need more people? To me, that lets me know that we're investing in our customers. We're investing in having the tools and resources for our people too.

Andrew Lasky (19:14)
That's awesome. I love that. Now in an industry where I'm assuming, obviously you guys have like contracts, right? For like a period of time, or maybe you don't. I would love to hear this. But I'm just curious to see because I come from the capital world where you sell a device that's 200 grand and if they have more money, sure, then they could buy more devices. But this is like, it's like a service, right? So if they start working with you today,

Konstantin Ekelman (19:37)
you

Andrew Lasky (19:40)
What's to stop them from working with somebody else tomorrow?

Konstantin Ekelman (19:44)
that's a great question.

differentiated. So where I worked before Airmark for nine years, it was very much driven by contracts. Three-year, five-year contracts for, because there was an investment with uniforms and floor mats in that world and the textile environment you would have to make so there'd need to be an ROI. In our world, a lot of people, a lot of my friends are surprised to hear this, but for the street business, there aren't any early contracts. And so we're only as good as our last order.

What that does is it provides our industry in this sector a high level of service because if you have contracts, sometimes people will hide behind their contract and say, you got three years left and service value can go down. I'm saying that's the case, but that naturally can happen. Just keeping it honest, right? But in our world, because for the most of the times our street business, there's no contracts.

Andrew Lasky (20:23)
Yep.

Yeah.

Konstantin Ekelman (20:32)
You have to really execute because people have options and because they buy from you today, they don't have to buy from you tomorrow. The reason that we're able to have such high retention and the reason we've had accounts in commercial real estate, for example, I'm really proud of this. We're at 90 % market share of the office buildings in the skyline and the suburbs. The reason we do that is because we provide a high level of service, but we also build relationships. It's a lot of networking events.

Andrew Lasky (20:50)
wow.

Konstantin Ekelman (20:59)
the business reviews that I mentioned and we don't give them any reason to change. And to the point where if a competitor calls one of my clients and says, hey, I want to save you money. They're thinking, I just saw Kostin his team and we're on budget. Okay. They say, well, service concerns. aren't any service concerns. I just had a business review and everything's good. Do you see your rep often? I do see my rep often. They come around every quarter and they're, how about response time?

They call me back within an hour or two hours, right? So we wanna be bulletproof and that's how we retain our business. Because people don't wanna change, especially in our category. They will change if they have disruption. And that's where we come in and that's how we win business. We're trying to find those pain points and we do. The hardest part is getting that meeting. Getting that meeting, getting someone to agree. Once we get in there, we feel pretty good and we like our chances.

Andrew Lasky (21:47)
I feel like I know the answer to this, but I want to ask it anyway. So anybody that's in sales, know KPIs, key performance indicators, what's that one KPI that you really obsess about and stress over for you and your guys to make sure that they're hitting it every single week, every single month, every single day, and every single quarter?

Konstantin Ekelman (22:08)
I would say that for me, the outbound in-person drop-bys, we call it in-person drop-bys where you're out visiting the prospect face to face. And yes, there's different, we're more localized approach. So my reps are able to go local. Obviously if you're calling from, if you're in Florida and you're calling someone California, that's, you're gonna be doing different sales methods. But for those B2B sales jobs that are,

Andrew Lasky (22:15)
Face to face with the customer.

Konstantin Ekelman (22:31)
local and they could actually interact with those in their community, I would say in person drop by and stopping by getting business cards. So I would say that's important. But the metric that I would say, Andrew, that I would say is equally as important is more of a results oriented one. It's how many opportunities did you find that week? How many did you put into your pipeline? So I stress to my team, got to find at least one new pipeline opportunity that you're going to engage in a sales process with.

And if it takes you 50 phone calls or 30 drop buys, then that's what you got to do. And networking and referrals, I think, is also important. As you interact in your book of business and develop your territory, are you networking enough to have someone get you in this door? Because as we know, as I hate to say this as a sales leader, and I always say earmuffs to my sales team, but...

The cold call approach is slowly becoming tougher and tougher every month, every year. And so it really becomes, you have to be more creative. How do you get in the door? And is it LinkedIn? Is it referrals? Is it an industry association that you go to make friends with there?

and develop relationships and then get opportunities. So I think it's important to really buy vertical, buy industry, evaluate that depending on what you're selling. I don't know if I answered your question, but in a roundabout way.

Andrew Lasky (23:48)
That's awesome. Yeah, no,

that's perfect. So yeah, it's all about filling your funnel and then keeping that relationship active with them. And Costa, I heard that you are very big when it comes to philanthropy. So could you tell the audience a little bit about what you're working on and what you do from that standpoint?

Konstantin Ekelman (24:09)
It's something that I didn't know I'd be as passionate about as I am today. But when the war in Ukraine broke out, I had a lot of people, they knew where I was from. And I built a lot of relationships in my industry because of all the industry events and just you're doing so many fun engagements with people. I had one of my clients come to me and say, hey, we should do a fundraiser for Ukraine. And at the time, we didn't know how, but we all wanted to help in 2022.

and being in love with basketball and being the Jordan fan that I am and a Steph Curry fan now.

Being a three-point shooter myself, I said, what if we did a three-point contest fundraiser event with the beverage and the food and the entertainment and networking, which was the key of what we do in our industry. So that summer we put together what turned out to be an incredible three-point contest fundraiser called Hoops on the Roof for Ukraine. And it was at the iconic Oak Post office building, which one of our clients, JLL, gave to us.

And we had 200 people show up, we raised 50 grand. We had 43 point entry participants and then another 160, 170 people came to make the 200 plus. And I wanted a Bulls player to come to that event. Cause I thought, you know, it'd be so fun to have someone from that NBA Bulls player come and support and even participate.

I networked but I failed. I tried my best. I couldn't get that person there. We had a really good event and we raised money for Ukraine refugees coming to Chicago. So wasn't a political thing. It was like people that need the help just like my family. So it was really close. Coming to Chicago, we had some support. And so everyone said, hey, when's year two happening? And I wasn't really planning on doing year two.

Then I met a gentleman named Jacob Ross, shout out Jacob Ross, and we got coffee together and he runs Luwal Deng's foundation and really involved with that through a company called Matter. And he says we should do a three-point contest fundraiser for the Luwal Deng Foundation which benefits South Sudan.

And at the time I was like, wow, this is really cool. Like he's doing something really special. And I said, well, what if we did South Sudan and Ukraine together, two countries that are bedridden by war and need support. He called Llewal and he said, if we can help two countries in need via basketball, why wouldn't we?

And so then in 2023, we did our second annual one at a really iconic office building with a NBA sized court. was 360 view of the city. was beautiful. We raised $100,000 at that event in year two. And to me, it was a culmination of my personal friends coming, my professional and philanthropy all combined.

Having my daughter stand next to me, have two daughters, at the time she was 10, stood next to me at my first event and my second event, and with Luol right behind me, and so we accomplished our goal of raising money, but also got an NBA player to come in. It was such a cool experience for all my clients there, for my sales team was rebounding basketballs. mean, we had, you know, in year one, you want to hear, in year one we had...

Andrew Lasky (26:59)
So cool.

Konstantin Ekelman (27:08)
my basketballs that I had from my house. have 25 basketballs that I bought because I'm personally trying to get a perfect round, 25 out of 25 shots. So the first year I had a bunch of my Spalding basketballs all beat up, PVC pipes for racks that we had to have racks for the balls I want to do it In year two, we got brand new Wilson basketballs donated by Wilson. We have the Chicago Bulls donate.

Andrew Lasky (27:18)
Okay.

Yep.

Konstantin Ekelman (27:36)
amazing racks to us, professional racks, not PVC pipes. And we raised twice as much. I mean, it was just best in class. And I'm super grateful for the relationships that I built through sales, which wouldn't have happened any other way to be able to give back. And I think that's really important to, what do you do with those relationships, right? You give back and I can't solve all the world's problems, but I was able to make an impact where

I was able to, and you got to, you cause there's no monopoly on world suffering, right? You help where you can. And so now year three, which is this year, you know, we're looking at doing another event and we're thinking of combining a Lewald Ng foundation and then Joe Kim Noah, one of his buddies, one of the guys he played ball with during the Bulls run. And he has a wonderful charity in Chicago, which would be really special to

Andrew Lasky (28:04)
Correct.

Konstantin Ekelman (28:23)
impact the violence that's in Chicago because right now there's a lot of gang violence there always has been and so Joe Keevenova's charity along with a gentleman named Kobe Williams they have one city basketball and they put gang members together on the same team in an effort to build empathy for each other on the court.

Andrew Lasky (28:40)
Wow.

Konstantin Ekelman (28:41)
And basketball

being the hook, they teach them financial literacy, domestic how to diffuse violent situations down, and really teach skills that are beyond basketball. And so we want to do another three-point contest, maybe five-on-five game at a really special venue. I can't disclose it yet, but we're finalizing the details to impact.

Joakim Noah's charity, One City Basketball and Kobe Williams, and then Lewaldang Foundation. And how cool would that be to, through basketball, continue to help out and something I'm passionate about. And again, we're talking sales, but sales is only, it's helping people, right? Yeah.

Andrew Lasky (29:15)
It's helping people. It's helping people. And I think

that's so cool, like what you've done, what you've accomplished to be able to give back to the community. it's crazy how the world works. You help people out and through the messaging and through the foundation and the event that you started, now you have three...

foundations coming together, all helping people at the same time. And that is just so cool. It really does create like a domino effect. And who knows where, you know, maybe you do a fourth and the fifth one, and then it gets bigger and bigger. So I think that is so cool what you're doing.

Konstantin Ekelman (29:51)
Yeah. And

yeah, thank you for recognizing that. think to me, I like what you said there. You don't know where it's going to go. And I think that's the exciting part.

And it reminds me and reinforces with my sales team and myself that I just keep meeting people because there's a lot of good people and the more good you're doing, the more good people that you surround yourself with. And I think that's what I've seen in my last three, four years that just follow your passions and keep meeting people. And so, yeah, thank you for allowing me a chance to describe that. That's something I'm very passionate about.

Andrew Lasky (30:22)
Yeah. Yeah,

it's super cool. so Costa, we're gonna get to the final four. This is the last part of the episode. It is the same four questions that everybody who comes on the show answers. And the first one being what is your favorite sales book or sales movie?

Konstantin Ekelman (30:41)
So sales movie, what popped out and it was a classic, I think in the nineties, Jerry Maguire, with Tom Cruise. You watch that one? And the reason I picked that one is if you look at Tom Cruise in that movie, he is a successful agent and then goes after, puts all his eggs in one basket and doesn't get there and then quits his firm.

Andrew Lasky (30:50)
Yep.

Konstantin Ekelman (31:04)
goes all the way back and finds his moral compass and the why behind what he wants to achieve long-term. And he built that strong relationship, dialing in on the receiver, I forget his name right now, and think Rod Tidswell, think is his name. yeah, Show Me the Money, famous line. But yeah, that movie was awesome. And he won as well. He helped him win and he won as well. he did it initially for the money.

Andrew Lasky (31:16)
Yes, yes. Show me the money!

Konstantin Ekelman (31:29)
went back and then did it to make him successful and he ended up winning as well. That was cool. Dale's book, say, Dale Carnegie has got to be mine. How to Win Friends and Influence Others, just so many lessons in that book and the teaching of curiosity, being curious in people. know, the simple strategy of.

Andrew Lasky (31:34)
awesome. Great, great movie. okay.

Konstantin Ekelman (31:48)
You know, people like to kill conversations, see it every day. It's one of my pet peeves and something that I used to do and I try not to do anymore. But in that book, teaches you, you know, if you and I were talking and I said, Hey, what are you doing for the 4th of July weekend? And you told me that, you know, what are you doing by the way? Tell me what you're doing. We'll practice it right now in stride.

Andrew Lasky (32:07)
Yeah, so I'm actually just hanging out. I'm actually going to Marco Island about two hours away here from Miami to hang out with my girlfriend's family and just hit the beach and just kind of relax, go to some nice restaurants over there and that's it. What about you?

Konstantin Ekelman (32:17)
Mm-hmm.

Thank you for asking. So we'll pause there. So if I was to kill the conversation, which that book stresses don't do, I would have said, I got buddies in Marco Island. And I would have just stole that right from you and made it about me. And so that book teaches stay in there and be curious. So instead, a good practice is to say, tell me about who you're going with and have you been there before and just keep learning. And then later, after you've given me all about your amazing plans,

Andrew Lasky (32:36)
Yep.

Konstantin Ekelman (32:51)
You would have either asked what you did, because you're naturally a good communicator, right? I would have shared about me and would have connected dots that I also have been to Marco Island before. And we have much more of a bond now because of that. And I think that book encapsulates that so beautifully.

Andrew Lasky (33:06)
Yep. So many people are about, Hey, what can you do for me? And when you don't stay shallow and you go into deep conversations with people, that's how you build something that actually lasts.

Konstantin Ekelman (33:19)
when I go out with my sales team on a meetings, I always observe for that. So for example, in a sales meeting, we want to understand some pain points and learn about their issues. And so one of our prospects that we're meeting with face to face says, when we say, Hey, tell me about your service or good open ended question. And they say, Oh, we're not getting a really good response time from our current rep. What you don't want to do is kill the conversation by saying,

yeah, yeah, here, I'll be your dedicated rep and I'll take care of you I'll be responsive. Stay in that fight a little longer. Instead of asking that, you just say simply, well, what's the impact when you don't get a response? well, I have to figure it out for myself. And how does that impact you? well, I have to go on the website and I have to call a hundred different people and I got a lot of other things going on. When you have to do that, what other things are...

than not getting done. well, I have to make my marketing efforts and I have to reach, make sure my team is coming into work. So again, you have to drill down and just continue to drill down on that pain point genuinely, right? You have to do genuinely because we want to understand because you can't, if you want to diagnose a situation, kind like a doctor, you can't just walk into a doctor's office and the doctor's like penicillin or whatever the latest drug is.

Andrew Lasky (34:30)
Yeah.

Konstantin Ekelman (34:30)
You

wanna understand it and if I'm a patient, I don't want a doctor that's gonna ask me a whole lot of questions about my knee pain and my back to make the best recommendation, right?

Andrew Lasky (34:40)
Because if they didn't, then you would think, okay, this guy doesn't understand what my problem is. And he's just pushing a pill or medicine or whatever the case may be. So yeah, it's a great, great thing not to do just in sales, but just like in life. So, so coast, the question number two is, you know, what's a sales tactic that

Konstantin Ekelman (34:57)
Sure.

Andrew Lasky (35:02)
you you started to implement or like a mind shift that really changed sales for you. And you kind of said earlier in the show about something similar to what we just talked about, like listening and understanding, hey, why did the Mexican restaurant owners, you know, start their business? What was that process? Like, I'm curious to see if you want to go in deeper and elaborate on that, or maybe you have something else that you want to share with the audience.

Konstantin Ekelman (35:29)
That's definitely one. One other thing that comes to mind is I learned this at Aramark and I implement it now at North American Brady Plus and teach my sales team. And it's just a good, when you get a first meeting and you're at that first meeting,

there's a little bit of a recipe in my head of what I want to accomplish in the conversation. And I think having a play, a plan that's successful that you could pivot in and out of is important. And to me, it's very simple. We build rapport together initially, and that looks like good open-ended questions, some personal open-ended questions, and then some business. However, you read the room. Is this the type of person that wants to share or they just

let's get down to business. So being able to adjust is good. But let's say we're doing the rapport building. The next is decision making process. You don't want to say, hey, Andrew, who else should be in this meeting? It's besides yourself, besides who all should be a part of this meeting. Asking it that way is important because you want to get everyone involved. And too many people are afraid to ask, hey, is there anyone else that should be a part of this? To me, it's just not, it's about not wasting time. It's about.

If we meet with you and then at of the meeting, find out I should have been meeting with these other three people. I just tripled my efforts. Let's consolidate. And then it's about, hey, you agreed to this meeting, Andrew. What is your goal and what do you want to get out of it? Because they all agreed on meeting, right? You didn't just show up. They said, yes, you can come. Well, what do you want to accomplish? It's kind of putting it to them. And then getting into the state of the service or offering that you're providing, what they're looking for.

Andrew Lasky (36:55)
Hmm.

Konstantin Ekelman (37:01)
and then summarizing and then getting a next step. You got to get that next step. So to me, that is the recipe. And the last part of it is too many sales folks, sales leaders in general, they get back in their car and they start driving, put on their music, put on their podcast. To me, I think it's really important when you get back in that car and you should have a moment of silence and reflection. What went well? Did you do?

20 % of the talking, 80 % of the talking. That first meeting should look very much like 80 % of the talking was done by them and you did 80 % of the listening, right? So to me, that's like a, call it a strategy that I just copy and paste, copy and paste, copy and paste. And sometimes it follows perfectly and sometimes not. But in my head, that's the play that I'm running in my mind.

to successful. And I hope that's helpful to any listeners out there that are doing it slightly differently. And there's not a perfect way, but I think that works for me and our teams.

Andrew Lasky (37:53)
Yeah,

no, it's it's extremely important to debrief every meeting every legitimate sales call. Obviously, you know, if you're debriefing every single cold call that you make throughout the day, that might be a little bit much. But if you actually have a scheduled meeting, you definitely want to reflect, see what things you did extremely well so that you can keep doing those things. And then the things that you feel that you didn't do so well, you want to be able to plan

Konstantin Ekelman (38:09)
for sure.

Mm-hmm.

Andrew Lasky (38:21)
and prepare for the next time either that objection comes or a question that you just don't have the answer to. You want to make sure that you're prepared for that. So that's awesome. Question number three, what is your favorite purchase that you've ever made with a commission check?

Konstantin Ekelman (38:30)
Exactly.

You'll notice the theme here, basketball is kind of important in my life. So I, when I was younger, I saw Michael Jordan had an indoor basketball court, full court.

So my dream when I got older, I don't know how it would do it was to get an indoor basketball court. So I haven't exactly had a chance to get indoor, but when I got into our newer home, it was really important to get a basketball court. I, I, spent the money and invested into a full court outdoor basketball court. It's not NBA size, but it's, it's long enough for full court. My older friends have a good time running up and down. And I more importantly, I spent a ton of time on there with my daughters.

and my 12 year old now and my five year old and my friends come over. I've had client meetings on it. let's just say it's an investment that has been a dream come true for me, but it's also been fun for a lot of folks and the neighborhood as well.

Andrew Lasky (39:27)
So cool. Definitely send me a picture of that. I definitely want to see that. So your daughters play basketball too? That's awesome.

Konstantin Ekelman (39:29)
We'll do.

Yeah, the five year old's getting

good at dribbling and my 12 year old, she's actually going to a really cool camp next week, which I'm really excited for her basketball camp. But yeah, she plays on the park district team. I've had a chance to coach her teams as well. And it's a special experience that I'm grateful to have and it's a bond for sure.

Andrew Lasky (39:51)
It's awesome.

I love that. And then the last question, question number four, knowing what you know now, if you had to start all over again, what would be like the very first thing that you would do to get back to where you are in sales today?

Konstantin Ekelman (40:04)
Number one, I would record myself or videotape myself and doing more role plays. I think that was the cheat code for me. And the biggest thing I learned, so at my last job, I'll save it for a side chatter, but the guy that I report to now was my sales manager at my former company. And...

He was a, he's a great mentor for me in life and professionally. But during the training at Aramark, we role played a whole sales process from the phone call to that first time meeting to the presentation. And then he sat there and we, for an hour and a half, watched all of the footage, phone call first time, and we analyzed it and dissected it. Like you said, he debriefed on it.

And that was so powerful to watch yourself communicate. You notice the mannerisms, the pace in which you speak. And it was really impactful. And so I would do that more and more and more and have done it more times. And...

That's great. And then I would say also building relationships, not just pipeline, because there was probably a lot of deals that I didn't win where I didn't keep in touch. So I would go back and if you lose a deal or it wasn't a right, it wasn't, I'm going to go with you right now. You would still keep in touch with those people because eventually you'll be top of mind and you'll get the business.

Andrew Lasky (41:16)
turning to business.

That's awesome. Costa, this has been such an amazing podcast. If people want to learn more about you, where can they find you?

Konstantin Ekelman (41:27)
think LinkedIn is a good place to start. Constantine Eklman. And yeah, I'm definitely excited. Well, as our event forms for our three-point contest, our third annual, I would love any support from any of the listeners. And yeah, we're going to do some fun things. And anyone to come out to Chicago, if you're in Chicago and you're listening, we'll see you there.

Andrew Lasky (41:44)
What are the dates on those?

Konstantin Ekelman (41:46)
Well, we haven't finalized October, November timeframe. I'll be posting on LinkedIn and some of the other social media platforms. I'm very excited for that.

Andrew Lasky (41:53)
Awesome. Well, Kosa, thank you so much for being a part of the show. Really appreciate you coming on and I will talk to you soon.

Konstantin Ekelman (41:59)
Thank you, Andrew. Appreciate it.